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Post by kalashnikov on Dec 16, 2007 11:47:18 GMT -5
Its about time fuck nato and west serbia should emidietly allow russia to put military bases in serbia.
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Post by Itchie on Dec 16, 2007 16:01:25 GMT -5
Why doesn't Montenegro give the Russians that enormous naval base in Tivat? It was built at a cost of billions with underwater reinforced concrete caves for submarines to hide in, would be a shame to waste.
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Pravoslav
Praporshchik
Pravoslavni Zajedno!!!
Posts: 106
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Post by Pravoslav on Dec 16, 2007 20:03:57 GMT -5
"Plunge the Serbs into another war with NATO over Kosovo?" If the Russian military was in Serbia (along with their anti-aircraft equipment) NATO wouldn't bomb or invade Serbia. They'd be too cowardly. Having several of the NATO countries gang bomb little Serbia was the act of cowards. They even used the OSCE mission to spy and plan bombing targets to help make it easier for them. They'd never fight an active war with a country which has weapons equal are greater than their own. They'd never fight a country which has nukes and can send them to each NATO country. Remember that NATO ALREADY has 16,000 troops stationed in Kosovo, and the Americans are building the one of the largest military bases in the world. How would Russia get troops into Kosovo without confrontation? Although Russian troops and bases in Serbia is a very good idea. |
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Post by Lonevolk on Dec 16, 2007 21:41:37 GMT -5
Some of the stuff he says sounds extreme, but I suspect it's just words and he can say it because he is in opposition. If he ever came to power he would be faced with the reality of government. And some of the stuff I've read actually makes good sense and he is better than Tadic IMO. Also, he would need to be in coalition with the DSS as the Radicals probably won't have enough support to govern by themselves. But I'm sceptical he would be allowed to come to power. The west will do everything to prevent that.....Lets see what happens Why doesn't Montenegro give the Russians that enormous naval base in Tivat? It was built at a cost of billions with underwater reinforced concrete caves for submarines to hide in, would be a shame to waste. There was some talk about that, but since MN is a Nato colony, it would be a miracle if that were to happen. I don't think direct Russian military presence in Serbia (or the wider Balkans) will happen at the present time, but things could change soon |
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Pravoslav
Praporshchik
Pravoslavni Zajedno!!!
Posts: 106
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Post by Pravoslav on Dec 16, 2007 22:46:20 GMT -5
I don't think direct Russian military presence in Serbia (or the wider Balkans) will happen at the present time, but things could change soon Do think this because Russia doesn't want to station troops here or because the countries governments' don't want Russian troops on their soil? |
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Post by Lonevolk on Dec 17, 2007 6:35:29 GMT -5
@ Pravoslav
Probably a bit of both, but mainly because the political situation isn't favourable.
Serbia seems like the most likely candidate for a Russian base, but it won't happen without a change of the current government.
There is also the fact that ALL the surrounding countries are in Nato (or will be soon) so keeping the supply lines open would be difficult if not impossible.
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Post by pastir on Dec 17, 2007 7:23:54 GMT -5
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Pravoslav
Praporshchik
Pravoslavni Zajedno!!!
Posts: 106
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Post by Pravoslav on Dec 17, 2007 8:27:44 GMT -5
Did you forget to say something Pastir or did Lonevolk just beat you to it? |
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Post by CHORNYVOLK on Jan 24, 2008 13:29:43 GMT -5
Over half of Ukrainians against joining NATO - survey
18:52 | 24/ 01/ 2008
KIEV, January 24 (RIA Novosti) - Over 50% of Ukrainians would vote against joining the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, according to a survey carried out by the country's Democratic Initiatives foundation.
According to the poll, 53% would vote against joining the alliance at a referendum, and 32% would back membership.
Prime Minister Yulia Tymoshenko said on Saturday that a decision on whether Ukraine should join NATO will only be taken through a referendum.
In the survey, 51.9% of respondents said they viewed NATO as an aggressive imperialist bloc that would draw Ukraine into military conflicts.
Democratic Initiatives spokeswoman Irina Bekeshkina said the main reason why people do not want Ukraine to be a NATO member is their fear that the country's relations with Russia could be ruined.
The poll was conducted from December 5 to 18 last year. A total of 1,800 people were polled, with a margin of statistical error of not more than 2.3%.
Last week Ukrainian Foreign Minister Volodymyr Ohryzko handed a request for Kiev to join NATO's Membership Action Plan to the alliance's secretary general, Jaap de Hoop Scheffer.
The Russian Foreign Ministry warned on Tuesday that the country would have to take "appropriate measures" if Ukraine were to join NATO.
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gleb
Starshiy Leytenant
Posts: 363
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Post by gleb on Jan 24, 2008 14:13:54 GMT -5
I love Ukraine and Ukrainians. That would be so sad if our countries would have their relations more hard than today. Very bad that our politics can not find common language to make us closer to each other. Russia now have got an opportunity to lose Ukraine forever.
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Post by CHORNYVOLK on Jan 24, 2008 17:09:29 GMT -5
I love Ukraine and Ukrainians. That would be so sad if our countries would have their relations more hard than today. Very bad that our politics can not find common language to make us closer to each other. Russia now have got an opportunity to lose Ukraine forever. The western Ukrainians will lose the east with their west ass licking. |
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gleb
Starshiy Leytenant
Posts: 363
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Post by gleb on Jan 25, 2008 2:24:32 GMT -5
I think that they won't lose East. Not only the West Ukrainians voted for Timoshenko. With every day Ukraine appears to be further and further from Russia.
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Post by pastir on Jan 26, 2008 10:35:29 GMT -5
Starship Troopers
A fairly well known science fiction novel. But also a bit more than that. In it the author presents and promotes a system where only those that served in the millitary have the right to vote.
He got criticised for being a fascist and a militarist for it, which I don`t think he was. But at the same time I think his system if for example used in today`s USA would lead precisley to that.
The idea is that only the people that care about their nation (and thus serve in the army to contribute to it and prove it) would be the ones involved in the decision making in the nation.
But the problem is that in today`s USA a true (and inteligent) US patriot would almost certainly not be joining the US Army in it`s present state because its imperialism, the millitary-industrial complex and the welfare-warfare state are what are bringing that country down in the first place. So you would basicaly end up with a state directed by a bunch of brainless gung ho rednecks and ideologoues of the benevolent global american hegemony, that wouldn`t even need to manipulate the popullation (who wouldn`t get to vote anymore) to get their way.
However. If you have an army that isn`t a tool of someone`s imperialism, but is a true people`s army, then this becomes a very interesting preposition.
Lets say you have an army built on the Swiss model, but even more so. An army that is a fiersome defence to any invasion due to huge numbers it can put under arms in a matter of hours, but which is at the same time next to useless in an imperialistic war the popullation doesn`t support, because well, if the people don`t want to fight who is going to make them? The number of proffesional soldiers that could be sent against them is minimal and the people have army issue automatic rifles under their beds!
In this case it does seem it would be an improvement to limit the right to vote to army reservists. It isn`t tyranical or anything of the like, because the non-voters stil have every other rights and because anybody can sign up for the army, do the 6 month training and then be a reservist for life. But it does ensure only the people that love the nation and are thus prepeared to defend it have a say in the decision making. Simply if you are an Albanian that hates the country you live in, a Cedomir-Jovanovic-voting "citizen of the world" that is disgusted by his own people, or a militant Trotskyte "without nationality" well then I`m sorry lad - but then you shouldn`t be allowed a say in the first place.
It is absurd the right to participate in decision making should be extended to those that actually wish ill to the country.
It is like a herd of sheep inviting a couple of wolves to help them come up with a decision what is best for the sheep.
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Post by anubis on Jan 26, 2008 19:01:33 GMT -5
The main problem is that state does not always = nation. Besides voting is a really silly way of picking leaders anyway
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Post by srbobran on Jan 26, 2008 19:45:29 GMT -5
Spot on, Pastir.
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