Slavs, Jews & Israel.

[jaropolk]

I cant keep silent about the ungrounded, unconditional antisemitism going on in this forum.

This is for daver2, joko, alexandrus and others.

My grandfather was jewish. He was born in 1911 in a little town near Kiev-Zvenigorodka. His father was killed during the Revolution (not as participant in any meaning). When he was 13 he had to go work on a factory. (Those were the difficult years after the civil war). Often he and his friends had nothing to eat, if they were lucky, they could smoke to lessen the hunger. Later he got the chance to study and became engineer. Then he moved to Leningrad in 1938 (his work demanded it).

When the war came(22 june 1941), he was one of the first to subsribe as volunteer. But they refused him (because he was an engineer, they said he was needed more in the rear, for now. From those who left from Leningrad in the first days only 2 % survived the war).
He defended Leningrad in 1941, fought at Kursk in 1943, where he was wounded, liberated Kurland(Latvia), where one of the strongest SS forces were cut off, and fought in Ukraine in 1944, went to the far east to battle the Japanese after 9 may 1945.

He received two red stars( Орден Красной Звезды), a service-in-battle medal(За боевые заслуги) and a medal of honor( За отвагу).

After the war he got several patents on high pressure molding.
He worked very hard and could easily climb up to become factory leader, but he didnt want to hustle.

He married my grandmoter(who waited for him the hole war) and they got two children. He didnt participate in politics in any way.

He died in 1981 of bloodcancer at the age of seventy.



I dont know about Polish jews, but Soviet-Jews were not cowards, they fought just as fierce as ethnic Russians.

[Orao]

The anitsemitism here is most worst with the Russians and Poles it seems to me...
South-Slavs have no reason to hate Jews really...

[ljubos]

I think that people connect jews with communism, nkvd, owners of big factories exploiting workers.. So i think you shouldn't take that as an attack on your grandfather, but more on that jews.

[ceskybojovnik1938]

...Dont take it personally mate. I dont think any member would personally attack you or your Grandfather.

I am half "Anglo-Saxon" and there is alot of hatred directed towards Anglos on this forum but its just an opinion, and as long as you or your family are not personally insulted dont take it to heart.

And about your Grandfather Jaropolk, he sounded like a trully remarkable man.

[daver2]

jaropolk said:

I cant keep silent about the ungrounded, unconditional antisemitism going on in this forum.

This is for daver2

Why me?

I thought I was the biggest antagonist of the "Jewish-hate" section of this forum. I've included my opinions in several posts here. That was me who always laughs when hears some bloody, funny conspiracy theories mostly related with Jewish stuff

[Vladimir]

First things first, there ain't no such thing as antisemitism, because majority of modern day Jews aren't Semites at all. Neither by blood nor by culture. Only religious affinity is the thing by which you can identify a Jew i..e Judaism ( whether liberal or conservative is not very important).

Since this is Christian and Slav forum only, you must choose your loyalties - you can be either Russian/Slav and therefore Christian or a Jew. You can't be both at the same time.

As for antijudaistic and antizionistic attitudes on this forum, if we have the right to criticize one group of people, we also have the right to criticize other group of people that we feel were our wrong-doers through the past and the present. Jews included.

While I can't say whether your granddad was good or bad person, ( although I believe he was good) that's not the point of our discussion. Jews don't belong to the areas where Slavs live and are by no means part of the Slavic world!

@orao - uvuci mu se u dupe još malo, možda dobiješ ček od ADL-a.

[Orao]

nat1onal15t said:

First things first, there ain't no such thing as antisemitism, because majority of modern day Jews aren't Semites at all. Neither by blood nor by culture. Only religious affinity is the thing by which you can identify a Jew i..e Judaism ( whether liberal or conservative is not very important).

Since this is Christian and Slav forum only, you must choose your loyalties - you can be either Russian/Slav and therefore Christian or a Jew. You can't be both at the same time.

As for antijudaistic and antizionistic attitudes on this forum, if we have the right to criticize one group of people, we also have the right to criticize other group of people that we feel were our wrong-doers through the past and the present. Jews included.

While I can't say whether your granddad was good or bad person, ( although I believe he was good) that's not the point of our discussion. Jews don't belong to the areas where Slavs live and are by no means part of the Slavic world!

@orao - uvuci mu se u dupe još malo, možda dobiješ ček od ADL-a.

Da si neki covjek, ko sto nisi, prva bi ti i jedina recenica bila da osudjujes antisemitizam koji je ovdje naspram najgorih Hitlerovaca, a nebi tu filozfirao i opravdavao mrznju.... tj, preseravao se.

[Vladimir]

Ti si mentalno oboleo čovek i treba da se lečiš i to u nekoj psihijatrijskoj instituciji. Priviđaju ti se nekakvi antisemitizmi, Hitleri i mržnja... možda delirium tremens?

[Orao]

nat1onal15t said:

Ti si mentalno oboleo čovek i treba da se lečiš i to u nekoj psihijatrijskoj instituciji. Priviđaju ti se nekakvi antisemitizmi, Hitleri i mržnja... možda delirium tremens?

Tebe napravio psihijatar Karadzic?

[daver2]

nat1onal15t said:

Jews don't belong to the areas where Slavs live and are by no means part of the Slavic world!.

Not exactly. In some Slavic countries they had belonged to the areas where Slavs lived. In Poland since 13th century to 1945 (1968). In Russia they still have a strong position in every aspects of its environment.

[Vladimir]

daver2 said:

Not exactly. In some Slavic countries they had belonged to the areas where Slavs lived. In Poland since 13th century to 1945 (1968). In Russia they still have a strong position in every aspects of its environment.

Let's be realistic Dave, native Land of Jews is Israel/near east and not Poland/Europe.

As for your argument for how long they lived in Poland, well, there are Germans who lived longer in Poland but no one's saying we want them still there...

[Vladimir]

You forgot that Anna Politkovskaya stayed too ;D

[Orao]

nat1onal15t said:

daver2 said:

Not exactly. In some Slavic countries they had belonged to the areas where Slavs lived. In Poland since 13th century to 1945 (1968). In Russia they still have a strong position in every aspects of its environment.

Let's be realistic Dave, native Land of Jews is Israel/near east and not Poland/Europe.

As for your argument for how long they lived in Poland, well, there are Germans who lived longer in Poland but no one's saying we want them still there...

With that argument it was legitimate Serbs were expelled from Croatia or?

[Vladimir]

dobojlija said:

With that argument it was legitimate Serbs were expelled from Croatia or?

I knew you'd pull that up...

NO, it's not the same thing, simply because no one can draw the boundary between the Serbs and the Croats with 100% accuracy, since both nations are of the same ethnic and meta-ethnic origin, and were living in the same territory since the day they came to the Balkans.

[Orao]

nat1onal15t said:

dobojlija said:

With that argument it was legitimate Serbs were expelled from Croatia or?

I knew you'd pull that up...

NO, it's not the same thing, simply because no one can draw the boundary between the Serbs and the Croats with 100% accuracy, since both nations are of the same ethnic and meta-ethnic origin, and were living in the same territory since the day they came to the Balkans.

That might apply to Bosnia perhaps, which truly has a mixed population of Croats and Serbs. But even there through the ages it was known anyone who is Catholic was not Serb for example.

But with most of the Croatian Serbs, especially Krajisnici no... Isn't it known they settled there with the coming of the Turks so around 1300-1400?